[ANNULE] Changement majeur des règles : capacités optionnelles et responsabilité des capacités déclenchées

Emmanuelle et Emilien a écrit:

Enfin ça, c'est en Competitive et Professional : en Regular, les informations dérivées sont en fait publiques et tu dois aider ton adversaire complètement et honnêtement à obtenir toute information non-cachée.

L'idée est la même : en Regular tu n'as pas un adversaire mais un partenaire de jeu. En Competitive on te retire les petites roues et c'est chacun pour soi.

I apologize for making light of this subject, as (apparently) some number of people are quite concerned about the impending death of Magic, due to the latest IPG changes. I should have shown more respect for their concerns. Since I firmly believe that Magic will not, in fact, be killed by this, I was a bit flippant with my reply, below.

However, I was serious about the key points in that reply: be patient, and hit 'Pause' on your Panic Button until we've provided more material; [...]

There are two critical deadlines that need to be met, whenever we change one of our official documents:
1) the deadline to get it published (Dec 20 was our deadline for the IPG - and really, a little bit before that)
2) the deadline to explain, educate, iron out wrinkles, etc., before it actually takes effect (Jan 1st, in this case).

I can assure you, many people worked very hard - none more so than Toby Elliott - to meet that first deadline; people are working just as hard now to meet that second deadline. Had we tried to complete everything before the first deadline, then this (very necessary) change would almost certainly be delayed until the next publication deadline.


As mentioned previously, there is more information forthcoming; some in its final review phase, some still being crafted. (One example: there's a current project underway, to evaluate every card in Modern, to see if it fits into "beneficial" and thus Optional, or not; that doesn't need to be done before the new policy is published, obviously, but it would be very nice to have before the next PTQ season. We're doing our best!)

As for some of the questions over the last few days going without an [O] answer from me, Toby, anyone... well, as I mentioned, there's a lot going on; taking time out to answer questions might further delay answering all questions! I happen to believe that many - maybe even 90% or even all - of your questions will be answered in the next few days. If not, then we can certainly use this list to address remaining concerns and questions.

Froggy a écrit:Un chouette article a propos de ces changements de règles.

• Les règles sont confuses et complexes à saisir et apprendre.
  
• Ca permet d'éviter que les bons joueurs doivent "payer" pour les erreurs des moins bons.
  

Official Statement from Matt Tabak, MTG Rules Manager a écrit:Hi all,

Some among you may have noticed that the January 2012 version of the IPG has been removed from the rules section of our website. The changes to that document have been met with a lot of scrutiny and confusion over the last few days, and rightly so.

While we work on a new version of that document, the October 2011 version will remain in effect. We hope to have the new version up before January 1, but working around the holidays can sometimes be chanllenging, so don't be too surprised if it's a bit later than that.

Let me emphasize some of the philosophies behind the tournament rules: 1) Tournament play should welcome new players, protect the honest, guard against abuse, and foster competition. 2) Different levels of play will have different levels of enforcement, but the game doesn't change. The deck you bring to the kitchen table works the same way it does under the bright lights of the Pro Tour.

To that end:
1. Players will not be responsible for pointing out triggered abilities they don't control. This change was met with near-universal praise. At competitive events, the player must assume responsibility for his or her own cards.
2. If an optional triggered ability is missed, it is missed. No player is penalized, and the ability is essentially "lost." You can identify an optional triggered ability in two ways: it says "may" or it asks for a numeical choice (including number of targets), and 0 is a valid choice. The controller is simply assumed to have declined the ability or chosen 0, as appropriate.
3. Number of cards whose functionality is changing: 0. None. Zip. Zilch.
4. Number of cards that will play differently depending on what level of event you're at: 0. The empty set. The big goose egg.

There will be additional information made available in time detailing what exactly the Missed Trigger infraction entails, who gets penalized for what and when, and what players and judges can expect. Until then, I'll leave you with some principles of the changes:

1. If you forget a trigger that benefits you, you're unlikely to be penalized for it ouside of missing out on the effect. There's also little reason to alert a judge at that point. (e.g. Your opponent forgets to put a counter on his Shrine of Burning Rage. Just let it go. He's not getting a warning or the counter.)
2. If you forget a trigger that is to your detriment, you're likely to be penalized with a warning. Pay attention to your own stuff.
3. You will always have a window to point out that an opponent has forgotten a triggered ability and have the effect resolve. If he controls Honden of Whatever the White One Was Called, and you really want him to gain the 2 life, you'll be able to have that happen.

Also, keep in mind that under the current and future sets of rules, purposefully forgetting a mandatory triggered ability in order to gain an advantage is Cheating. Capital C there.

There are a lot of weird situations (e.g. Howling Mine, Curses, etc.) that can come up, and we hope the new IPG will cover them all. Minor gaps may exist, and we'll address them as we go along. (Really, I mean minor gaps, not glaring holes like last time.)

Have fun!

Official Statement from Toby Elliot a écrit:A very important message from Toby Elliott:

So I hear that some stuff happened.

Thanks to everyone who sent email or grabbed me on irc. I apologize if I haven't replied to your message - I got... a few emails. I did read every single piece of feedback that was sent to me, though, and it was all valuable.

It's clear that what we tried to do didn't quite work for everyone. A lot of the criticism out there is just wrong (though that's a sign that it might be more complicated than we expected it to be), but a lot of people had legitimate points or good suggestions, and we'd be foolish to hang onto a policy that clearly wasn't going to accomplish our goals - they were getting lost in various side issues.

So, we huddled together in various groups and tried to get at the core of what we were trying to do, to see if we could find a system that was more streamlined but still achieved our goals. And I think we've gotten somewhere that gets us like 90% of what we wanted while being a lot easier for players and judges (and R&D, for that matter).

What I'm going to do here is lay out the new rules that will go into place for January 1. Because of the holidays, it's going to take a few days to get the formal wordings for the IPG posted to the website, but this should give you all you need to know at this point. Once again, don't panic.

Here's what the players need to know:

1) Unless your trigger has 'may' printed on it, it is mandatory and you can't choose to forget it. Doing so remains Fraud.

2) You are not required to point out your opponent's triggers. If they have missed one that you wanted to happen, you have until the end of first main/end of combat/end of turn (whichever comes first) to point it out and ensure it happens. After that, many triggers will not happen (though some will).

That's it! Please spread the word to all your players.


On the judge side:

1) 1.4 is being rewritten to be clearer. Now that the opponent has easy recourse, a lot of the quirkier definitions go away. Plus, a whole lot more cards have been looked at, which means we've fine-tuned some things. Thanks especially to David Lyford-Smith for his efforts and suggestions.

Note that the goal here is still not to comprehensively identify every trigger or ETB replacement that could possibly be good. We just want to identify things that can realistically be handled in one particular way. What's that way?

2) When an ability covered by 1.4 is missed, and the opponent declines to point it out within the timeframe mentioned above, the ability goes away - no penalty, no trigger. If it isn't covered by 1.4, then you just go down the rest of the missed trigger flow chart and resolve it as expected, including penalty. Of course, if you think that an ability is being missed intentionally by the controller, you should investigate, but these situations now look a lot more suspicious than they used to.


We think that this approach places the appropriate responsibilities on the players at the appropriate times, and is much, much easier to explain. It also accomplishes our goals - making remembering your triggers a bit more skill testing at Competitive levels, cutting down on missed triggers for small beneficial things, and avoiding a lot of the unintuitive situations that putting a trigger on the stack at a later point can cause. Hopefully you'll feel the same way. Obviously you don't have the exact details yet, but I wanted to get this out as fast as we possibly could so that you know know that we were addressing the issues.

As always, I'm happy to hear your feedback. I'd like to thank everyone who sent it in, especially Jason Lemahieu and Matt Tabak, who spent a lot of time and energy working through everything.

Have a happy holidays, everyone!

Toby

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Alexandre a écrit:Je ressucite cet article car je pense que c'est lié et j'ai vu une situation qui m'a un peu étonné. Je regardais le webcast du GP Columbus hier soir, et lors d'un match un joueur (A) a une Deadly Recluse équipée du Ring of Kalonia. (equipped creature has trample, at the beginning of your upkeep, if equipped creature is green, put a +1/+1 counter on it).

Son adversaire (B) joue Switcheroo et échange un token Soldat contre la Recluse ce qui incline le jeu en sa faveur. Avant de repasser le tour, A se lève et va demander à l'arbitre si il a le droit d'oublier le trigger du Ring sous les nouvelles règles (lapsing), car il contrôle toujours le ring et à sont upkeep l'araignée gagnerait un autre compteur +1/+1.. Le juge répond non, A se rassied, il pioche et concède et on passe au game 2.

Ce n'est pas borderline comme play? Il a quand même demandé au juge si il avait le droit de tricher, non?

2. If you forget a trigger that is to your detriment, you're likely to be penalized with a warning. Pay attention to your own stuff.

Alexandre a écrit:Ce n'est pas borderline comme play? Il a quand même demandé au juge si il avait le droit de tricher, non?